Misplaced support posts and incompetent contractors

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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:28 pm

Thanks Shannon & Spruce, I'll be sure to heed your advice. I'm pretty sure the load from the front 'lean roof overhang' will be attached to the level of the horizontal stud at the top of the wall (please see pics). I remember Spruce had sent me a photo with two red circles, where the rafters meet the top of the wall, and we discussed sloop steepness required, based on snowload...

I may have a new issue on my hands, with the installed window on left wall (please see photos). I noticed that the Blueskin at the top perimeter of the window did not stay adhered, to seal the gap there due to substandard wood used for window frame - header. We didn't use primer when we used the Blueskin, because it was around 15 degrees, and the manufacturer recommendation is 'use primer if 10 degrees or under." What to do now? Get appropriate primer and re-seal the Blueskin?
Happy Saturday!
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:40 pm

Just found a photo of the window frame that shows how the frame is, before window got installed...
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:42 pm

Oh this could be the front window frame, not the side window. But, the side window has similar gap, maybe smaller...

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Shannon
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:58 pm

That last picture looks like the view of the header and how it was constructed. Looks ok other than I can’t tell how many nails and how close they were but I will assume they were ok.
If the door framing is really plumb you could likey just add a 1x4 where you removed the 2x4 and still have enough room to shun and install door frame.
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:49 pm

Thanks Shannon, re the door rough opening having to be reframed, we will add a 1x4 and do a 'dry fit' with door and see if there's enough room...

It looks like there's some confusion on the last picture. Sorry I meshed two issues into one post, so it became a little confusing. The last picture is a view of one of the two window headers; I had thought it was for the left wall window (which is now having an issue with the Blueskin having pealed off the cavity in the window frame) but then I realized the picture is of the front wall window. Both window frames have weird cavity space due to the wood being flawed gouged. When the windows got installed, we put Blueskin to seal the cavity, but now it has pealed off on the left window - I was hoping you and Spruce might have some advice on how to deal with cavity space and how to reattach the Blueskin that has pealed off the left window. Sorry for the confusion!

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A. Spruce
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by A. Spruce » Sat Oct 20, 2018 10:01 pm

I have no experience with blue skin, so I can't offer anything there.

As far as the header is concerned, that looks to be a typical laminated header, two 2x and a piece of 1/2" plywood was used to make up the needed 3.5" overall width.

That's probably confusing, lumber is not actually the nominal dimension denoted by the numbers. A 2x4 is actually only 1.5" x 3.5", basically, all lumber is 1/2 undersized like this, there are a couple of reasons for it that are of no consequence. The point is, two 2x for a header only add up to 3" and you need 3.5" in width for a 2x4 framed wall, hence the 1/2" plywood. There is nothing wrong with a header of this nature, unless specified otherwise by an engineer or planning department.
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sat Oct 20, 2018 10:09 pm

Thanks Spruce, for explaining this. Size of the lumber and plywood aside, is it ok that there is significant cavity space due to the edges of the 2x4 have gouges approx at the center of the frame (the top piece)? Should the cavity be taped over with a membrance like Blueskin?

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by A. Spruce » Sun Oct 21, 2018 12:34 am

Do you have a pic of this specifically, it is unclear what you're describing.
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:04 am

I think what you are referring to is actually the rounded edges of the outer tree surface on those pieces of wood. Where I am that is very common , we are lucky to get one actual square corner on a 2x4 or 2x6 here.
This is nothing to worry about.
The loose membrane at the top inside of the window is no big deal either. When you insulate the opening just put the insulation between the window and the membrane.
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:35 pm

Yes! Thanks for figuring out what I was asking! Ok when we insulate the windows (LOW-expansion foam) we'll put some between the membrane & window frame.

I'm now trying to figure out which materials are best for installing subfloor and vinyl plank flooring. Someone suggested that "Dricore" would be a good choice:
https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.235- ... 88120.html
The description sounds good and appropriate for my studio 'outbuilding' but I'm a little concerned about having OSB just under the plank flooring. When I picked OSB in my minivan (for the first contractor), the off-gas seriously aggravated my asthma and I also got a headache for hours. I read that OSB made in Canada absolutely does not have UF, but the PF and other resins do release a small amount of formaldehyde gas...
If I use Dricore, would it be safe and effective to put a layer of oil based low VOC primer (like Kilz) on the OSB before installing plank flooring? And, would doing this compromise the breathability of the insulation layer of Dricore?
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:42 pm

PS
A challenge re finishing the floor is the door sill and base studs are 2x4, so we only have 1.5" to work with, for subfloor and vinyl plank flooring. I guess an option is to redo the door frame entirely, raise the header, so that we have more "thickness" to work with...

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:34 pm

Ok so first off yes sprayfoam between the membrane and vinyl window frame. Before you do this use a flat bar or stick or whatever to try and lift and restick the membrane temporarily until the foam is installed. The reason is that the low expansion foam may not have the pressure to lift the membrane fully back up.

The is no actual reason to use Dri Core in your situation it is really ment for use over concrete floors. I will assume that the existing wood floor is not insulated ? I would personally use carpet as it will be warmer then LVP flooring. Either way you could install a layer of 1/2” plywood over the plywood there ,stagger the joints so they do not line up with existing joints. You can then install LVP or carpet over that.
The wood 2x4 plate across the bottom of the RO for the door should actually be cut out and removed. Most doors thresholds are about 1” thick so if that is not thick enough to allow the door to swing open freely over the flooring and any place mat then you can place a piece of plywood under the threshold to raise it.
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Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:37 pm

Thanks very much, Shannon, for replying so quickly - it looks like you never take a day off, not even Sunday!

Ok we will make sure the the membrane sticks to the window frame before applying the spray foam.

I'm sorry I forgot to say that my shed was built on concrete slab, so I do have a concrete floor to insulate and finish. Carpet is warmer for sure, but what about moisture issues? People keep warning me that backyard buildings like my studio tend to get mold in a couple of years, in our climate, if I have my walls finished in drywall. And, they said, make sure to use vinyl flooring, not laminate...
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Shannon
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:30 pm

I'm normally on here at least a half dozen times a day, some days more some days less.

Ok sorry I guess I never realized that this was a concrete floor, then yes Dricore or other types like it would work great.As for the off gassing I can't really say , non of that really bothers me at all. Generally these products have been sitting in warehouses or stores so I would think they would not be bad but who knows everyone is different.

You could for sure install a floating LVP over this after wards.

As for the 2x4 in opening, these Dricore panels are 7/8" thick I believe and many LVP products are around 3/16" or so.I would figure out your situation based on how high the threshold is on your door and wanting at least 1/2" to 1" of that above the finished flooring. This will give you some room for a low pile rug at the door if you decide to use one just as a walk in place mat.
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A. Spruce
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by A. Spruce » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:33 pm

Day off??!!?!!?!?!??!!?! What's that?!?!?!?!?!? :)
If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:59 pm

A. Spruce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:33 pm
Day off??!!?!!?!?!??!!?! What's that?!?!?!?!?!? :)
For me it means no yardwork, housework, emails, texting, and cooking but forums like this is always a go!!!

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:13 pm

And thanks, Shannon, for all your suggestions. Do you think it's ok to paint the layer of OSB on Dricore, with oil based primer before installing LVP? I guess once I get the Dricore there'll be manufacturer's instructions but it might not specifically address this issue...would really appreciate your opinion!

Btw I found a contractor who recommended doing "stud extension" to my 2x4s, so that I can use R22 Rockwool, which means we will add 2 inches to the studs to make 5.5". I guess the most efficient way is to use 2x10x8, cut off 1.5 inches, and cut the rest into four true 2" wide pieces?

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:17 pm

But, wouldn't we also need to put extensions along all the horizontal base studs (sorry don't know the correct terminology!) on the concrete?

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Sun Oct 21, 2018 10:39 pm

Painting the OSB would be fine as far as I can see.

Personally I would just use 2x6s and cut them in half or to exactly 2” if you prefer.

The bottom and top plates would all need to be built out the same as the studs and other framing.

This project just gets bigger and bigger.
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by A. Spruce » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:23 am

Vivian wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:59 pm
A. Spruce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:33 pm
Day off??!!?!!?!?!??!!?! What's that?!?!?!?!?!? :)
For me it means no yardwork, housework, emails, texting, and cooking but forums like this is always a go!!!
Yeah, uh, I'm still not following . . . :mrgreen:
If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:13 am

Ok how's about this on your day off... since you live in California! : )

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:15 am

Whoops forgot the pic...do you follow now, Sprucey : )))
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by A. Spruce » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:26 am

Ok, now I'm starting to understand. :mrgreen:
If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

Vivian
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:36 am

Shannon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 10:39 pm
Painting the pan would be fine as far as I can see.

Personally I would just use 2x6s and cut them in half or to exactly 2” if you prefer.

The bottom and top plates would all need to be built out the same as the studs and other framing.

This project just gets bigger and bigger.
Yep the project has become much bigger than I expected, maybe I should skip the stud extension.
But ok I'll suggest cutting 2x6s with my new contractor...that would make the extended studs just 1/4" wider than the ideal 5.5" stud cavity for R22 Rockwool, which I know would not be a problem.
I had actually emailed a Building Science Manager at Rockwool a month ago when the stud extension idea was first suggested to me, because the "first contractor" was not willing to cut to exact 2", and would just add 2x2x8, which meant only 1.5" extension to make 5", so I emailed Rockwool and asked:

1. “What happens or may happen if 5.5" ROCKWOOL COMFORTBATT® is compressed to fit within a 5" stud cavity? I guess the R-value would be reduced, but will the ventilation capability also be compromised so that I may have excessive moisture build-up?”

<His answer>
It is not recommended. It would add pressure on the interior finish and slightly reduce the R-value of the product. The vapor permeability of the product would be moderately affected.

2. “What happens, or may happen, if 5.5" ROCKWOOL is installed into a 6" stud cavity?” <adding 2x3 to 2x4 would make 6" cavity>

<His answer>
There is no problem with this. It would then be recommended to push the batt towards the sheathing in order to have the ½” air space on the warm side.
However, note that the actual dimensions of 2x6” wood studs are 1.5x5.5”. This is why the batts are 5.5” thick.

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:44 am

All sounds correct to me.
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:20 am

Shannon wrote:
Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:44 am
All sounds correct to me.
Thanks for confirming!
I managed to 'take a day off' but had to check in here...
Still trying to decide whether I should have the studs extended to 6''
It would mean losing approx 12 sf of interior square footage, 10% of the 10'x12' shed

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:36 am

Your adding 2" basically to each wall so you would be losing maybe 7 sq'. You will not even know the difference. I'm not saying you should do it ,I'm just saying that would not be my first concern at all. Look at the cost in materials and labour VS. amount of time you will spend in there? Another consideration would be likely less energy to heat the space.
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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:50 pm

Shannon wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:36 am
Your adding 2" basically to each wall so you would be losing maybe 7 sq'.
My new contractor said he would use 2x3x8, which is why I thought I would lose 3" of interior space all around. This is how I calculate the loss of space:
(3x10)+(3x12)+(3x10)+(3x12)=132
132/12 = 11
So it's actually 11sf, not 12 sf

Using 2x3 would give us 6" cavity space, which means 1/2" air gap on the warm side of insulation - I know this would be ok.

Yep I need to weigh the extra material & labor costs, loss of space, versus the benefits of R22 insulation and savings in the long run... It's hard to say how much time I'll be in there, most likely more in the summer than winter. Occassionally it will be used as guest house...

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Vivian » Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:51 pm

Ah ok it's actually 2.5" when it's 2x3!
We always get "short-changed" when buying lumber! : )

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Re: Misplaced support posts

Post by Shannon » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:10 pm

the point I was making is it’s not much as far as floor space but it more about cost vs if you think it is worth it.
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