Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

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doirondon
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Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Mon May 15, 2017 11:47 am

Hi - I have two 55 gallon drums plumbed up to my gutters to collect rain water.
The system works great for filling up buckets and so on.

I'm now looking at watering my lawn/garden and want to put a hose and sprinkler on to the system, but need more pressure. I've considered & looked at a shallow well jet pump with pressure tank, but I think that may be a little excessive for what I'm trying to do and for the amount of usage this will actually get.

Now evaluating the feasibility of patching this up to the system - an on demand pressure pump.
https://www.amazon.ca/Seaflo-Diaphragm- ... 131&sr=1-3

Along with an additional screen strainer to save the pump.
https://www.amazon.ca/SHURflo-255-313-C ... N02E8V4VWP

Note - that specific model I posted (Seaflo-Diaphragm-Pressure-Caravan-Marine) runs off 12v DC - so my end goal would be to patch into my home panel panel (120v AC), but would need to spec out and install a transformer and such - correct?

Thoughts & comments?
Other solutions or opinions?

Thanks,
Don


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A. Spruce
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by A. Spruce » Mon May 15, 2017 11:54 am

I think I'd simply source an inexpensive 110v portable sump pump that you can connect a garden hose to, drop it in the barrel, plug it in, and you're done.

The one problem I see with your plan is finding a pump that will pressurize enough to operate sprinklers, you may want to rethink the use of sprinklers and opt for either flood type irrigation or using soaker hoses, there are many hose types to choose from that offer very little back pressure.
Last edited by A. Spruce on Mon May 15, 2017 1:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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doirondon
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Mon May 15, 2017 12:34 pm

Yea - thought about the portable sump pump idea - but my barrels are under my deck and laying on their sides and everything is sealed up. So yea I could... But I'd have to redo and rejig my layout and such.

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by Shannon » Mon May 15, 2017 12:59 pm

I'm not sure that pump will have enough pressure to use a sprinkler in it? I think you may have to go to something bigger than that, I could not say for absolute certainty though.
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by A. Spruce » Mon May 15, 2017 1:24 pm

The primary concern is to find a pump that will do what you want/need it to do. Looking at your link, that is a 35psi pump, less than half of normal house pressure, which is probably not going to be enough to run a sprinkler.
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Mon May 15, 2017 1:42 pm

A. Spruce - would this one at 55 PSI be better suited?

https://www.amazon.ca/SHURflo-4008-101- ... 182&sr=1-1

I see in the comments someone uses it to run their shower at a cabin.

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by A. Spruce » Mon May 15, 2017 1:55 pm

Typical house pressure is 60 to 80 psi, so , yes, this is a better choice
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Mon May 15, 2017 3:10 pm

doirondon wrote:(Seaflo-Diaphragm-Pressure-Caravan-Marine) runs off 12v DC - so my end goal would be to patch into my home panel panel (120v AC), but would need to spec out and install a transformer and such - correct?
Unless you have a 12V supply, I'd recommend a 120V motor.. ie, an existing generator battery or solar battery.

Sealflo has a 120V model here (fair bit more expensive, so you may want to shop around)
https://www.amazon.ca/Shurflo-4008-171- ... 08-101-a65

This one has the same GPM, but they don't specify the psi
Last edited by emtnut on Mon May 15, 2017 5:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by A. Spruce » Mon May 15, 2017 3:47 pm

It does not take pressure to have high flow rates, so GPM values won't be of any use.
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Mon May 15, 2017 5:35 pm

A. Spruce wrote:It does not take pressure to have high flow rates, so GPM values won't be of any use.
It's all about Head :mrgreen: Head pressure that is :lol:

The 12V pump is listed at 55psi @3GPM.
The 120V just says 3GPM.
I'd check with Mfr to be sure it's 55psi, and how much that drops with elevation !

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Mon May 15, 2017 7:38 pm

Would a shallow well jet pump work...?

http://www.globalindustrial.ca/p/plumbi ... Ah8j8P8HAQ

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by Shannon » Tue May 16, 2017 8:03 am

doirondon wrote:Would a shallow well jet pump work...?

http://www.globalindustrial.ca/p/plumbi ... Ah8j8P8HAQ

IMO that is exactly what you want !
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Tue May 16, 2017 8:36 am

Bit pricey thou :o

Check out these at Norther Tool ... http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... alesRank|1

There are quite a few under $200 that would fit you application

This one is portable, so you just have to plug it into a receptacle
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... #key-specs

This one is $80 ... 131' of head , around 55 psi
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... _200675884


I like the one that says "Wayne" on it :mrgreen: :lol: 8-)
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Tue May 16, 2017 8:49 am

Thank you for the suggestions and comments - really appreciate it.

I just found out my father in law has a shallow well jet pump that I can have (that he's not using anymore and still works), so I'm going to try that one first cause the price is right - free. :)

If that doesn't end up working I'll def consider/evaluate what you suggested EMTNUT.

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by Shannon » Tue May 16, 2017 6:48 pm

emtnut wrote:Bit pricey thou :o

Check out these at Norther Tool ... http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... alesRank|1

There are quite a few under $200 that would fit you application

This one is portable, so you just have to plug it into a receptacle
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... #key-specs

This one is $80 ... 131' of head , around 55 psi
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/ ... _200675884


I like the one that says "Wayne" on it :mrgreen: :lol: 8-)
Of course you like the the one that says "Wayne"! :roll: :roll:
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by A. Spruce » Wed May 17, 2017 8:22 pm

emtnut wrote:Sprucy ... You're more than just a pretty face, aren't you 8-)
Sadly, when you're as pretty as I am, you have to be three times as smart as the next guy. :lol: :lol:
emtnut wrote:I like the one that says "Wayne" on it :mrgreen: :lol: 8-)
Now, if only you could figure out how to get a commission on those pumps . . . :lol:
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by Shannon » Wed May 17, 2017 10:57 pm

A. Spruce wrote:
Now, if only you could figure out how to get a commission on those pumps . . . :lol:

Try searching on Amazon with our affiliate link , I don't mind the small commission :oops: :oops:
https://www.amazon.com/Tools-and-Home-I ... 3df6d19ccc
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Thu May 18, 2017 8:03 am

Shannon - I shop on amazon alot and would support you, but I do my shopping through ".CA" and not ".COM". Be great if you could get lined up with the ".CA" store.
Then man... You could retire on just my purchases. :)

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by Shannon » Thu May 18, 2017 12:33 pm

doirondon wrote:Shannon - I shop on amazon alot and would support you, but I do my shopping through ".CA" and not ".COM". Be great if you could get lined up with the ".CA" store.
Then man... You could retire on just my purchases. :)
Admin. has been looking into it but it is apparently structured differently and not really something we are going to do for now. Thank you though!
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by Admin » Thu May 18, 2017 8:03 pm

We now have an Amazon.ca affiliate link, I just set it up. Use this every time you order from Amazon.ca and we'll get a small commission (on anything you buy after clicking).

https://amzn.to/2rxddmX

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Fri May 19, 2017 6:26 am

NICE!!!! Now watch the money roll in boys! :)
You're welcome... :)
haha

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Fri May 19, 2017 10:57 am

A. Spruce wrote:
emtnut wrote:Sprucy ... You're more than just a pretty face, aren't you 8-)
Sadly, when you're as pretty as I am, you have to be three times as smart as the next guy. :lol: :lol:
Don't be sad ... If you keep working on it, you'll get there :mrgreen:
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Fri May 19, 2017 10:59 am

Admin wrote:We now have an Amazon.ca affiliate link, I just set it up. Use this every time you order from Amazon.ca and we'll get a small commission (on anything you buy after clicking).

https://amzn.to/2rxddmX
Well ! ... It's about time !! :lol:
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by A. Spruce » Sat May 20, 2017 11:57 am

Shannon wrote:
A. Spruce wrote:
Now, if only you could figure out how to get a commission on those pumps . . . :lol:

Try searching on Amazon with our affiliate link , I don't mind the small commission :oops: :oops:
https://www.amazon.com/Tools-and-Home-I ... 3df6d19ccc
This was directed at Nutzy because of the "wayne" thing. :mrgreen: Glad to see you tossing your link out there more though! 8-) 8-)
I'm CDO, it's the same thing as OCD, but in alphabetical order like it should be! I've also got a touch of AD/OS, Attention Deficit . . . Oh, Shiny!

doirondon
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Thu May 25, 2017 8:39 am

The old jet pump has been re-purposed and works like a charm!

Took a quick video to show her in action.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vc7Sf_gr8M

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Thu May 25, 2017 6:05 pm

doirondon wrote:The old jet pump has been re-purposed and works like a charm!

Took a quick video to show her in action.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vc7Sf_gr8M
That's awesome !

I'm considering doing the same at my place. A very 'green' solution, and rainwater is the best for plants and lawns.
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Fri May 26, 2017 11:55 am

Next thing - further down the line - I want to get a solar panel and a battery to run the pump, but that's later...

In short term I want to run a switch to turn the pump on and off and such.
I know how to wire it up with 14/2 and all that, but I'm going to need to go outside and against the inside framing of my deck. I've never run wire outside in exposed area... What's code for doing that?
14/2 in conduit enough?

Here's the switch I'd like to patch up.
2017-05-26_14-42-54.png
2017-05-26_14-42-54.png (206.33 KiB) Viewed 161 times

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Fri May 26, 2017 12:24 pm

doirondon wrote:Next thing - further down the line - I want to get a solar panel and a battery to run the pump, but that's later...

In short term I want to run a switch to turn the pump on and off and such.
I know how to wire it up with 14/2 and all that, but I'm going to need to go outside and against the inside framing of my deck. I've never run wire outside in exposed area... What's code for doing that?
14/2 in conduit enough?

Here's the switch I'd like to patch up.
2017-05-26_14-42-54.png
For your cable, you should use 14/2 NMWU for the outside part. You can't run regular 14/2 in conduit.
If you do run conduit, then THWN (single insulated wires) would be used.

You'll need a Bell box as well (weatherproof box).

The switch cover looks good. The switch should be fine ... but what is the hp of the motor you have there ? (for larger motors, you need a HP rated switch)
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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by doirondon » Fri May 26, 2017 12:32 pm

What's more cost effective or pros cons to both wiring options?
14/2 NMWU or THWN with conduit?

Yes regarding the weatherproof box - I'm aware of that part.

I believe it's a 1/2 horse or 3/4 horse.
I didn't realize you'd need a diff switch for the higher rated HP. I just thought - it runs on 120v so... a 120v switch?

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Re: Rain Barrels - Water Pressure Pump

Post by emtnut » Fri May 26, 2017 12:43 pm

doirondon wrote:What's more cost effective or pros cons to both wiring options?
14/2 NMWU or THWN with conduit?

Yes regarding the weatherproof box - I'm aware of that part.

I believe it's a 1/2 horse or 3/4 horse.
I didn't realize you'd need a diff switch for the higher rated HP. I just thought - it runs on 120v so... a 120v switch?
NMWU will be a bit cheaper, if none of the wiring is exposed to possibility of damage, it would be the way I'd do it. Conduit offers some protection (from whipper snippers etc .. ), but costs a bit more.

1/2 HP would be the max for a regular switch. If it's a 3/4HP, you should use a HP rated switch.
HP rated switches allow for the initial inrush of current when you turn on the motor

*edit* ... 1/2 HP is the max on a 20A switch , 1/3HP max for regular 15 Amp switch.
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